A slow publication  ·  Conversations with the living world

Rooted & Restless

Conversations where nature becomes the mirror

Vol. I  ·  Issues 01–03 Aotearoa New Zealand 2024–2026
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Contents
Issue 01
Conversation

On plants as lovers, ancestors, and grief containers

A gardener who learned to see the world through the soil talks about inheritance, decomposition, and what trees remember.

Karla Brodie  ·  Wellington, Aotearoa

Field Notes
Essay

Learning to let things die

A migrant from China arrives in New Zealand with no relationship to plants. Then the plants start dying, and something begins.

The researcher  ·  Wellington, Aotearoa

Issue 02
Conversation

Practising extinction: on dying, decomposing, and resisting

A performance artist who teaches bodies to compost themselves talks about grief, Umwelt, and the politics of learning to die.

Olive Bieringa  ·  Oslo / Aotearoa

Issue 03
Conversation

Plants can't say no, but they know you're there

A Taiwanese plant enthusiast on empathy, plant colonialism, and a spiritual coincidence neither of us expected.

Vicky  ·  Taiwan

Issue 04
Conversation

When plants colonise the city — and why that's not enough

An Auckland visual artist whose photo-collages document forty years of plants pushing through urban concrete talks about ecological grief, resilience, and why nasturtiums are a political act.

Deborah Crowe  ·  Tāmaki Makaurau Auckland

Issue 01  ·  Conversation Karla Brodie  ·  Wellington

On plants as lovers,
ancestors, and grief containers

A gardener who learned to see the world through the soil talks about inheritance, decomposition, and what trees remember.

Rooted & Restless  ·  Issue 01 Karla Brodie
Before we begin

We spoke on a video call, Karla from her home surrounded by plants she has accumulated over decades, me from my Wellington apartment, where six borrowed plants — left by friends who had moved away — were arranged on the windowsill. Outside, the trees were bare. I had been thinking about grief all month.

Karla Brodie grew up with her hands in the earth. Her great-grandmother had a chamomile lawn you could smell when you stepped on it. Her grandmother let things run riot. By the time Karla had her own bedroom, it was full of plants. She gave each one her attention the way some people give attention to people.

I came to Karla because Olive Bieringa had mentioned her — as someone who practises ecosomatics in the most ordinary way, without the theory, just the life. I wanted to understand how a person genuinely rooted in the natural world experienced grief differently. What I found was a conversation that kept turning back to me, to my own estrangement from the living world, to the synthetic mind I had been handed at birth and had only recently begun to question.

Karla is a gardener, a yoga and meditation teacher, a practitioner of Ayurveda. She tends worm farms. She saves seeds. She takes cuttings from every garden she visits, which means her garden is an archive of friendships, visits, and people who are no longer nearby, or no longer living.

The conversation

On growing up inside the green world

When I ask Karla about her earliest memories of plants, she doesn't describe a single moment. She describes a lineage. Her great-grandfather on his knees on a chamomile lawn. Her grandmother's garden, overgrown and generous. When she studied Ayurveda, she had no human study partners. So she used plants instead.

K

The vata dosha — the air element — I was looking at bamboo, growing very quick and hard and fast. And then for pitta, the fire element, it was the things that were flowering. And the earth element was kauri trees — very slow growing, very steady, these big solid trunks. Nature became the lens I see myself through, and also how I teach.

This is ecosomatics before it had a name. The body reading itself through the body of the forest. The idea that you can know something in your cells before you know it in your mind.

"I feel like if I connect with one kauri tree, I can connect with all the kauri trees. It's very intrinsic to me."

— Karla Brodie

On alone as all one

K

Sometimes I suffer from loneliness. I feel a sense of separation or isolation. And then the next minute — my house is full of plants, I have animals here, I have trees. So I can't really be alone. "Alone," if you spell it out, is "all one." That loops back into my spiritual tradition, where we are interconnected with everything.

Karla says this with the weight of someone who has actually felt it in the body — the shift from contraction to expansion, from the loneliness of the self to the companionship of the ecosystem. It's the same shift that Olive Bieringa's ecosomatic practice tries to create through movement. Karla arrives at it through attention.

On the magnolia tree and how grief moves through seasons

A close friend of Karla's died. During the mourning period, there was a magnolia tree outside — deep in bud, not yet flowering. She looked at it one day and made a decision.

K

I saw it and I was like: I have to remember to see beauty in this time of deep grief. And so those flowers — over the course of time — slowly grew and bloomed and let go. A really important part of that grief process for me was actually seeing the cycle, the seasonal cycles.

What Karla describes is a form of ecological attunement — the capacity to be held by natural rhythms rather than forcing them to hold still. The magnolia didn't speed up or slow down for her grief. And in following its tempo, she found a way through. Time as a companion. The tree as a clock that ticks at the right pace for mourning.

On decomposition as autobiography

When I ask how she moves through grief, Karla gives me an image. She and her lost friend were like two trees growing side by side. When he died, he dissolved — into flame, into stars. And she was left as timber. Heavy. Disconnected from the ground.

K

Then once it started — once all my hacked-down wood started to decompose — I could grow from that and emerge from that. It was a rebirth, actually.

Karla has never attended a BodyCartography workshop. She has not read Olive Bieringa's writing on dying and decomposing as a somatic practice. She arrived at the same place through lived experience and Tibetan Buddhist meditation — through the body's own knowledge of how matter transforms.

"When a person dies, it's almost like there's more of a vividness of that person inside my body, rather than the memory of them outside of my body."

— Karla Brodie

On grieving for plants, and the grief that has no script

I tell Karla about the plant I thought was fake. I had it for three years — a pothos, unremarkable and green. I suspected it might be artificial. When it finally died, I felt a grief that surprised me with its force. And then I felt foolish for feeling it. There was nowhere to put the feeling except in the bin with the plant.

K

When a tree gets cut down around me, I am just angry and then very upset. Everything changed. The light changed, how it moved through the space. Your life literally changes when a tree gets cut down.

We talk about disenfranchised grief — the kind of loss that society doesn't recognise as legitimate. For plants, there is no funeral, no leave of absence, no one asking how you're doing. But this shapelessness might be exactly why it matters. A grief that has no social script has nowhere to go except into the body. And in the body, it might meet all the other grief that never had a script either.

On trees as ancestors and record-keepers

K

Here's this recent history of a tragedy, and they want to put in an artificial structure to memorialize people that passed. But then there's this tree that's been there for a lot longer. And they were saying: you're less important. Thank God the community protested. The tree is still there, in its place.

She talks about kauri trees — some over two thousand years old. Their rings hold drought years and flood years. They are not just old. They are archives. They are, she says quietly, our ancestors.

On cuttings and the social life of plants

K

That's how I grow my garden too. If I go to someone's house and they have amazing things, I'll be like — oh, could I have a cutting of that? My whole garden is full of connections to other people.

A garden as a social network, rendered in chlorophyll. Seeds as travellers, carrying memory across distance. She's not just growing food. She's composing a living archive.

* * *

A moment

Object from the conversation

Karla is wearing trousers she has owned since her early twenties. She is nearly fifty. There are holes at the knees — proper holes, worn through by time and use. She mentions this with obvious affection. She went back to the shop where she bought them, still wearing them, to buy a new merino singlet. She showed the shop assistant the holes. They understood. — The trousers do not represent failure. They represent the only kind of permanence that living things can honestly offer: the proof that something was really here.

Reading thread

01

Earth Emotions: New Words for a New World — Glenn Albrecht (2019). The philosopher who coined solastalgia — the grief of watching a beloved place change while you still live in it.

02

Entangled Life — Merlin Sheldrake (2020). On the underground networks connecting plants. Reads differently after talking to Karla about mycelia and what moves through soil we cannot see.

03

The Mushroom at the End of the World — Anna Tsing (2015). On what survives at the edges of capitalism. Karla's cuttings and seed-saving are exactly what Tsing calls "pericapitalist."

04

Ecological grief as a mental health response to climate change-related loss — Cunsolo & Ellis, Nature Climate Change (2018). Karla's grief for trees and plants is real, documented, and deserves the word.

Field Notes  ·  Essay The researcher  ·  Wellington

Learning to let
things die

A migrant from China arrives in New Zealand with no relationship to plants. Then the plants start dying, and something begins.

Rooted & Restless  ·  Field Notes The researcher's notebook

I grew up in a city that taught me plants were decorative at best and inconvenient at worst. I arrived in New Zealand as an alien — not just to the country, but to the entire register of living, growing, dying things that most people seem to understand intuitively. This is an account of trying to learn.

The plant I thought was plastic died on a Thursday. I had owned it for three years — a pothos, unremarkable and green, sitting on a shelf in my first Wellington apartment. I watered it sometimes. I moved it around. I suspected, genuinely, that it might be artificial. Then one day it yellowed, softened, and collapsed in the way that only real things do. And I grieved for it in a way that made no sense to anyone I told, and so I told no one.

That grief was my first real lesson in something I now think of as ecological literacy: the capacity to notice, to feel, to be affected by the living world. I had spent thirty-odd years cultivating its opposite.

I. The synthetic mind — what I was given

In the Chinese city where I grew up, plants were functional. They were herbs, ingredients, medicine — things with purposes. The body was a production machine. Intellectual achievement sat at the top of every value hierarchy. Farmers occupied a position of cultural condescension that was rarely examined and almost never challenged.

A note on irony

Traditional Chinese medicine is almost entirely made of plants. Every remedy, every formulation, every ancient prescription — rooted in botanical knowledge accumulated across millennia. We used plants constantly. We just refused to have a relationship with them. They were drugs, not companions.

This is what I am calling the synthetic mind. It expects permanence, reads decay as failure, and approaches a living thing with a maintenance protocol rather than a capacity for attention. Synthetic fibres don't decay. Refrigerators extend foods past their natural horizon. Supermarkets erase the seasons. And inside all of this — designed into the infrastructure of how we live — is a training in the avoidance of loss.

II. Black sand — the first lesson

The first time I had what I now recognise as an ecosomatic experience, I didn't know what it was. I only knew that I was lying face-down on a beach at Piha, on the west coast of Auckland, with black volcanic sand against my cheek, and that something had shifted in a way I couldn't immediately explain.

Karla Brodie had brought me here. I was in the middle of a divorce. Everything felt provisional. I pressed my face into the sand and felt the weight of the water in it. The wave noise came in at a frequency I could feel in my chest. For about forty minutes, I forgot that I was a person with problems. The grief, the uncertainty — it did not disappear. But it changed scale. It became one thing among many things, none of which were particularly concerned with me.

I moved to Wellington shortly after. I bought fifty houseplants. I killed most of them.

III. The apprenticeship of loss

Karla watched me kill the plants with patient, affectionate concern. "It's a listening," she told me. "It's an observation. It's a witnessing. You have that so exquisitely in so many elements of your life. But when you come to nature, it was quite new."

I approached the plants with a technician's logic: input, output, problem, solution. I had no framework for the possibility that they were simply doing what plants do — changing, struggling, adapting, sometimes dying — and that none of this required my intervention to be meaningful.

The synthetic mind reads a dying plant as failure. The natural mind reads it as continuation — one form releasing into another.

I began to understand that my grief for these things was not disproportionate. It was proportionate to something I had been taught to ignore. Every plant that died in my care was carrying some of the grief I hadn't been allowed to feel for all the other things I had lost — people, places, times, a self that belonged to another city and another life. The plant was just the container that finally cracked open.

IV. On time, and what places carry

When I bought my first house, the previous owners were in their seventies. They had built the garden over forty years. The wife sat in her chair on the last day and looked at the trees she had planted — trees that were now taller than the house — and wept.

What she was weeping for was not only the garden. It was every morning she had spent in it, every season she had watched move through it, every version of herself that had stood at that window or knelt in that soil. The garden was an archive of a life. And she was being separated from it.

I moved in and the trees were still there. I didn't know them. But I found myself caring for them in a way I couldn't entirely account for. As if I had inherited not just the trees but some part of her relationship with them. As if grief, like seeds, could pass from one person to another through the medium of a garden.

V. What the supermarket does

The supermarket is the synthetic mind's natural habitat. Inside it, time is suspended. There are no seasons, no localities, no cycles. Only the permanent present of the refrigerated aisle. Death is managed offstage, at a distance.

Karla told me about indigenous people in the Amazon who have no refrigerators — who go out each day to gather what they will eat that day and no more. A different relationship with time and trust: that what you need will be there when you need it, that you do not need to stockpile for a scarcity that may never arrive.

I recognised myself in the opposite image: the full fridge, the bulk-bought provisions, the hoarding instinct that pandemic living had intensified. I am preparing for a future scarcity, always. This too is a form of not being able to let things die — the refusal to trust in cycles, the insistence on holding on.

VI. The slow de-synthesizing

I still have plants I don't fully understand. I still catch myself reading care guides and then ignoring what the plant is actually telling me. But something has shifted. When a leaf yellows now, I don't always immediately try to correct it. Sometimes I just watch.

I have a merino wool jumper with a hole in the elbow. I have had it for six years. When I first noticed the hole, I felt the familiar synthetic-mind alarm. But then I thought about Karla's trousers, worn for thirty years, holes at the knees, still loved. The hole is not damage. The hole is evidence. It means the jumper was really here, really used, really part of a life.

De-synthesizing is not a decision. It is a slow unlearning — a returning to something that was already there, waiting, underneath the noise of efficiency and the fear of letting go.

* * *
Closing note

The borrowed plants on my windowsill are still alive. Six of them, left by friends who moved to other cities. I water them. I talk to them sometimes, quietly, when I think no one can hear. I don't know their botanical names. But I know which one leans toward the afternoon light, and which one prefers to be ignored, and which one I check on first in the morning, though I couldn't tell you why. This feels like the beginning of something. I am not sure it has a name yet.

Issue 02  ·  Conversation Olive Bieringa  ·  Oslo / Aotearoa

Practising extinction:
on dying, decomposing,
and resisting

A performance artist who teaches bodies to compost themselves talks about grief, Umwelt, and the politics of learning to die.

Rooted & Restless  ·  Issue 02 Olive Bieringa
Before we begin

Olive Bieringa was born in Te Whanganui-a-Tara — Wellington — and has spent much of her adult life in Oslo, where she collaborates with Otto Ramstad as the BodyCartography Project. I spoke with her the evening after she had been teaching a workshop on ecosomatic practice. She answered from a room full of natural light.

Olive Bieringa is a dancer who has come to believe that the most radical thing a body can do is learn to compost itself. Her practice — ecosomatics — starts from a simple premise: that the body is not separate from the ecosystem it inhabits, and that learning to feel this fully is one of the most urgent tasks of our moment.

I first encountered Olive's work through a description of her performance series Resisting Extinction, in which audiences gather at shorelines and riverbanks to practise dying together. The phrase stopped me. Not the dying — I had been thinking about grief for months. It was the word "practise." As if dying were a skill. As if it required rehearsal. As if the reason we are so catastrophically bad at grieving the living world is that we have lost the bodily capacity for it — and that capacity needs to be cultivated, like any other.

Olive is also a certified practitioner of Body-Mind Centering, a somatic modality that uses the body's own tissues — organs, fluids, bones, nerves — as sites of knowledge rather than mere mechanisms. She is a doctoral candidate at Uniarts Helsinki. She runs ecosomatic intensives in forests outside Oslo.

The conversation

On somatics as an already-ecological practice

OB

Somatics, if practised well, is already an ecological practice. I use the word "ecosomatics" simply as a tool to say: yes, we're going to practise this in the ocean, we're going to extend the field of our attention to include this whole ecosystem. That's the real deal.

What I hear in this is a refusal of preciousness. Ecosomatics is not a new discipline arrived from outside. It is an extension of attention — the same awareness that somatic practitioners bring to a knee joint or a breath pattern, now extended to the tree outside the window, the soil underfoot, the quality of air in a particular place at a particular moment.

On the body as host, and the host as body

OB

Ecosomatics helps us understand that we are not only organisms hosted by a planet — we are also a planet hosting many other organisms. That shift — from being the guest to being the host — changes everything. Your body is an ecosystem. It is also inside one. The boundary between them is porous.

"We practise living, breathing, sensing, perceiving, digesting, dying, and decomposing — to perceive more of the whole scale of the sensitivities and intelligences within us."

— Olive Bieringa

On teaching bodies how to die

OB

People encounter stillness, first. Most of us are not practised in stillness — real stillness, not just the absence of motion but the presence of attention without agenda. Then they encounter the ground. The weight of the body against the earth. And then — when they stay with it — something else. A softening of the boundary between inside and outside. You begin to feel like something that is happening, rather than someone who is doing things.

OB

The dying practice is really a practice of release. Of letting the body be heavy. Of trusting the ground to hold it. Of noticing what resists — because what resists is what we are most afraid of losing.

On grief as an ecosomatic practice

OB

The body and the emotion are not separate. Grief is the body registering a change in its relational field. Something that was connected is now not connected in the same way. The body has to adjust — has to literally remap itself. That takes time. That takes a kind of somatic intelligence that our culture has systematically trained out of us.

On Umwelt — the city as a perceptual world

I ask about the concept of Umwelt — the idea, developed by biologist Jakob von Uexküll, that each organism inhabits its own subjective perceptual world. I want to know how she thinks about the human Umwelt in an urban environment.

OB

Cities are choreographic. They choreograph our movement, our attention, our rhythms. We sit, we stand, we walk on surfaces designed to channel us in specific directions. What this does, over time, is narrow the Umwelt. We stop perceiving what the architecture doesn't point us toward. We stop feeling temperature gradients. We stop noticing roots.

OB

"Action movie" is one version of this work: closing the eyes immediately expands the auditory and tactile world, making the familiar strange, letting sensation rather than vision lead. You start to feel what you stopped noticing.

On the political stakes of dying well

OB

If we can't grieve, we can't act. If we can't feel the loss, we can't be motivated to prevent further loss. We have been told that the solution to climate grief is hope, optimism, positive vision. But I think we have to be able to mourn first. We have to actually feel what is dying, what has died. The body needs to know the truth before it can respond truthfully.

This is perhaps the most important thing she says in our whole conversation. We have built an entire culture of environmental communication around hope and inspiration — around the images of what we might save, rather than what we are losing. The consequence is a kind of emotional anaesthesia: people technically aware of the ecological crisis but who have not felt it in their bodies, and who therefore cannot sustain the kind of action the crisis actually requires.

"Somatics, if practised well, is already an ecological practice. The body already knows how to compost. It just needs permission."

— Olive Bieringa

On being from here

OB

There is something about the land here that I carry even when I'm not here. The pōhutukawa. The quality of the light. The way the ocean is very close to everything. Coming back and performing in Central Park felt important precisely because it was not pristine wilderness. It was a negotiated space. A space where the city and the non-human world are in conversation. That's where most of us live. That's where the work needs to happen.

* * *

A moment

Object from the conversation

During the dying practice in Resisting Extinction, participants are sometimes instructed to press their mouths against the ground. To breathe in what the soil breathes out. A reviewer described a performer in Central Park, Te Whanganui-a-Tara, "pressing their mouth into the ground and sucking up damp mulch." This is the work. Not a metaphor for connection, but connection itself — bacterial, sensory, immediate. The ground holds everything that has ever lived there. Putting your mouth to it is a form of listening.

Reading thread

01

Geographies of Us: Ecosomatic Essays and Practice Pages — Fraleigh & Riley (eds.), 2024. The first major academic collection in the field. Where Olive's work sits theoretically.

02

A Foray into the Worlds of Animals and Humans — Jakob von Uexküll (1934). The original Umwelt text. Every living organism inhabits its own subjective perceptual world.

03

Staying with the Trouble — Donna Haraway (2016). On refusing the consolations of either despair or progress, and learning to make kin with other species.

04

Mourning Nature: Hope at the Heart of Ecological Loss and Grief — Cunsolo & Landman (eds.), 2017. The theoretical undergrowth in which Resisting Extinction takes root.

05

Eco Soma: Pain and Joy in Speculative Performance Encounters — Petra Kuppers (2022). On disability, ecology, and performance practice at the edges of normal experience.

Issue 03  ·  Conversation Vicky  ·  Taiwan

Plants can't say no,
but they know you're there

A Taiwanese plant enthusiast on empathy, the ethics of care, plant colonialism, and a spiritual coincidence neither of us expected.

Rooted & Restless  ·  Issue 03 Vicky  ·  Taiwan
Before we begin

The soil surface of my plant had grown a layer of grey-white mould. I told Vicky about it — she is someone in Taiwan who has been growing plants for many years, soft-spoken but with a precise sensitivity to plants. It was a Wednesday evening. We talked for nearly two hours, moving from mould to death, from cacti to Medicine Buddha, from the colonial history of plants to the human ego. This article tries to hold onto the parts I found hardest to let go of.

Vicky is not a theorist, and not a researcher. She is simply someone who has grown a lot of plants, and in caring for them has gradually understood certain things. The kinds of things that academic papers can't quite articulate.

Our conversation began with a very concrete problem — the mould on my plant's soil, and my worry that I had done something wrong. Vicky said gently that mould already exists in the air; it just grows more easily when you give it food — like the cooled apple-cooking water I had poured onto the soil. She didn't blame me, but she didn't pretend it didn't matter either. She said: clear it away, and let the soil dry out a bit.

That approach — neither overprotective nor neglectful, learning to find a balance — became the undertone of the whole conversation.

The conversation

Plants don't need to think, but they keep getting more beautiful

V

They're not thinking, but they still grow. Isn't that already natural enough, healthy enough? They don't need very much. I think that's what I find most fascinating about plants — they're simple, and yet they just keep getting more and more beautiful.

This reminded me of what Karla Brodie said: plants are a mirror, letting you see how you relate to the world. But Vicky was pointing in another direction — plants aren't a mirror, they're a counter-question. They ask: why do you think you need to think in order to be alive?

Leaves are a plant's face — you can read what's wrong

Vicky said she has an intuition about which plant needs watering — sometimes she already knows before she's touched the soil. Then she said something that made me stop:

"Leaves are a bit like our face — like physiognomy. You can read from them what's happening to the plant. If the leaves have problems, that usually means the root system has some problems too."

— Vicky

I thought of my pothos — the plant I kept as if it were fake for three years. It never spoke, never changed, until the day it died. If I had learned earlier to read its leaves, to treat them as a face, perhaps I would have known sooner that it was real.

Reading a plant from its leaves is also reading a body from its skin — this is the starting point for the whole practice of ecosomatics: the outer state is the inner language, only we don't know how to translate it.

I feel a plant's pain — more directly than I feel a person's

I shared something with Vicky: every time I have to cut a flower stem, I feel a real, physical pain in my body. Not a metaphor — a bodily sensation. Then I told the slightly uncanny story of buying flowers for an Indian ritual, needing 108 petals, and the flower's leaves spontaneously falling to the ground as I closed the door — exactly 109.

Me

I felt like the plant was clairvoyant — it knew I needed its leaves, so it shed them for me first.

V

I also have the feeling that my plants and my emotional state are connected. When I'm not doing well, it seems like a lot of my plants start to feel the same.

I can't explain this. But throughout this entire research project, every time I speak to someone with a deep connection to plants, they mention some kind of inexplicable sensitivity. Vicky said her largest plant died around the same time her great-aunt fell critically ill. She had dreamed of the illness, and then the dream came true.

She said: you can't help but believe that this coincidence exists.

Plant abuse — the wordless, struggleless victimhood

Me

But what I'm thinking about is the unintentional kind — my kind — with neglect, overwatering, inappropriate care, and not being able to hear what it's saying. Because a plant can't tell me it wants water or doesn't. It has no way of saying no.

This question touched the most fundamental unease in my whole research: we hold all the power in a relationship that cannot refuse us. A plant cannot leave, cannot protest, cannot knock on your door when you ignore it. All it can do is change the colour of its leaves, and wait for you to finally learn to read its face.

Vicky said: it's fragile because it can't refuse you. But that doesn't mean you can't see it.

Coexistence, not a tool — I can't use a plant as an energy dustbin

"A plant's fragility lies in the fact that it can't refuse me. But that doesn't mean I can't see it. I can't treat it as a tool — for me personally, I think that's a form of abuse."

— Vicky

Vicky said she thinks the best approach is: let it be a companion, coexist together. Don't turn it into a tool, and don't turn it into your child — just a kind of equal, quiet shared dwelling.

The colonial history of plants — a class hierarchy in the flower market

Me

I feel like the plant world can be as brutal as human class hierarchies. Some plants are called weeds, but in Chinese medicine they might be medicinal herbs, in another culture they might be food. The chain of discrimination — I feel a sadness in the plants because of it.

V

It seems like no one has noticed this, they just want to do business. Always hunting for new varieties. Plants have been commodified.

This connects to something I keep returning to in my research: when we put plants inside market logic, they stop being living things and become perishable goods. And the cost of that thinking is that we lose the capacity to sense plant life — because commodities don't need to be sensed, only bought and discarded.

We eat them now; they'll eat us later

V

You know, in this ecological chain, after we humans die, who will absorb us in the end? Plants will. So it's actually very fair — we eat them now, and then they'll eat us later.

I stayed with this for a long time. It reminded me of the image Karla used about decomposition, and of Olive Bieringa's dying and decomposing practice. We are all part of the cycle of matter; we are simply too accustomed to seeing ourselves as the centre of that cycle, and forget that we are also food for plants.

This is not pessimism. This is a genuine equality — and the moment in my ecological grief research that moved me most: when we are willing to put ourselves back into the cycle, mourning and fear become something different. Perhaps a form of gratitude.

Get the roots right, and a plant is very hard to kill

V

The deep foundation of the root system doesn't change. It's like us — we might have certain settings that grow and flourish, but the underlying logic doesn't change.

This made me think of the migration metaphor I had been working on with Karla: a seed in new soil needs to adapt, even mutate, but its core DNA doesn't disappear. I left China, came to New Zealand, and lost much of my intuitive knowledge of plants and the natural world — but perhaps that deep layer, the part that lets me see petals falling to the floor and feel it as something like clairvoyance, was always there.

It just needed a more humid environment to slowly grow back.

* * *

A moment

Object from the conversation

At the end of our conversation, Vicky said she was planning to start chanting to her plants the next day to see if they would grow better. It turned out we had both been chanting the same mantra — the Medicine Buddha heart mantra — she had been given it by a Taiwanese abbot, and I by an Indian teacher. We only discovered this at the very end of our conversation. The plants had brought us there, and then we found that we had probably been reciting the same thing all along, for the same wish: to heal all beings. Including plants.

Reading thread

01

Ecological grief as a mental health response to climate change-related loss — Cunsolo & Ellis, Nature Climate Change (2018). The "disenfranchised grief" framework — why mourning plants has no social script, and the cost of that absence.

02

The Mushroom at the End of the World — Anna Tsing (2015). The colonial history of plants and the commodifying logic of capitalism — what Vicky calls "the Hermès of the plant world" is exactly what Tsing describes as the erosion of the non-scalable by market logic.

03

Entangled Life — Merlin Sheldrake (2020). The underground networks connecting plants — Vicky's intuition that plants sense your emotions finds a kind of scientific echo in mycorrhizal network research.

04

How Forests Think — Eduardo Kohn (2013). Plants are "thinking" too — just in a way we're not accustomed to recognising. Vicky's observation that plants don't need to think but still thrive poses the same mystery from the opposite direction.

Issue 04  ·  Conversation Deborah Crowe  ·  Tāmaki Makaurau Auckland

When plants colonise the city —
and why that's not enough

An Auckland visual artist whose photo-collages document forty years of plants pushing through urban concrete talks about ecological grief, resilience, and why nasturtiums are a political act.

Rooted & Restless  ·  Issue 04 Deborah Crowe
Before we begin

We spoke over video call, Deborah in her Auckland studio, surrounded by works just returned from exhibition. She had been through chemotherapy in the months before our conversation — she mentioned this early, lightly, and then moved on. She had made a sculpture containing her lost hair. She called it a work about resilience. I noticed that this was also the word she used, later, for mānuka.

Deborah Crowe has spent forty years photographing the places where plants push back against the city — weeds splitting pavement, mushrooms colonising walls, flowers seeding themselves in concrete gaps. Her photo-collage work splices these images into architecture, producing environments that are simultaneously utopian and unsettling: what the city might look like if the plants won.

I came to Deborah because her ongoing series Outlook — a decade-long visual diary of plant encounters in Auckland's urban environment — felt like a different entry point into the question I had been circling in all my other interviews: what does it mean to pay attention to plants in a world that has been systematically trained not to? Where Karla Brodie arrives at this through gardening, and Olive Bieringa through somatic practice, Crowe arrives at it through the eye of an artist who has spent four decades learning to stop at the things other people walk past.

She had been through a period of illness before we spoke, and she told me that our conversation had helped her reconnect with her practice — "a really good way of me to help me reconnect with my work." I thought about that afterwards. The interview as a form of ecological attention. The conversation as a kind of cutting, passed between people.

The conversation

On seeing with intent — the city as material

I asked Crowe what she actually sees when she walks through Auckland — what other people might walk past. She reached for John Berger.

DC

Seeing comes before words. The way that we see is affected by what we know or what we believe. An artist always looks with intent. You get people who are observational — but then you get people who observe with intent. I think it's just something that is in how I respond to moving around space.

She described the city as material — in the same way that a weaver thinks of threads. She trained as a weaver at Glasgow School of Art before moving to Aotearoa, and that framework has stayed embedded in everything she makes: "Everything for me feels like the act of weaving things together. It feels like many many strands of things getting interlaced to become whole. I think that's how I think about the city."

Time, she said, is also a material. "Having time pass and thinking about things feels a bit like a material." This is not a metaphor — it is a description of how she works. The Outlook series began in 2016 as a response to changes in her Karangahape Road neighbourhood, and has continued across a decade as a kind of visual diary: part observation, part politics, part emotional release.

"Outlook is a bit of an emotional release, I suppose. Sometimes it would be playful, and sometimes it would talk about the politics of change, or even consider urban planning. I think I'm probably a frustrated urban planner and architect."

— Deborah Crowe

On ecological grief — the swing between hopes and fears

I told her about the conversation I had been having across these interviews about ecological grief — the sense of loss when environments change or disappear. She recognised it immediately.

DC

Quite often, when you think about climate change and climate crisis and emergency, sometimes it's really gloomy. But sometimes you get hopeful. I imagine lush greenhouses where horticulturists cultivate super-plants that eliminate global emissions. This is obviously one of my hopeful days. On other days I worry whether Aotearoa, especially under the current government, will meet its Paris Agreement obligations.

Her series Don't Expect the Future to Look Like the Past emerged from exactly this oscillation — made in the aftermath of Cyclone Gabrielle, after reading extensively about eco-anxiety. She had subscribed for years to a newsletter called Gen Dread (later renamed The Unthinkable), dedicated to helping people live with the grief that comes from ecological loss.

DC

In making the artwork, I'm trying to raise awareness or talk about my response to what the future might be. But also slightly alarmist — seriously wanting to make works that are a little bit triggering. They might have images that look a bit like not quite a flood. There's a somberness. And then alongside that, there's always the cheerful.

This is a different position from Olive Bieringa's insistence on the priority of mourning. Where Bieringa argues that we must grieve before we can act, Crowe suggests that holding both grief and hope simultaneously — making art that is simultaneously "triggering" and "cheerful" — may itself be a sustainable ecological stance. Not resolution, but cohabitation with the tension.

On plants as memory — whakapapa and the lineage of cuttings

I mentioned what I had heard from other interviewees — that people often feel embarrassed by grief for plants, because there is no social script for it. Crowe took this somewhere I had not expected.

DC

I was thinking about how plants can carry memories. I've got a geranium that is from a cutting from my friend's batch that his family had for forty years. Or I've got another geranium from a cutting — when my mother came to Aotearoa to visit me probably forty years ago, and we would walk around the neighbourhood, and we used to do that terrible thing that lots of people do: just take a snip. And so I've had plants that, for the fact that I was on a walk with my mom and she took the cutting, I've transported from my home to another home to another home. The actual plant becomes so significant. It has a whakapapa — like it has this lineage.

A neighbour, she told me, has a tomato plant that has been in his family for eighty or ninety years. Each year they take new cuttings and give them to people, so that it spreads and spreads. The plant is not one plant — it is a distributed archive of a family's history, encoded in biology rather than paper.

"You're right, there's no social script for it. And I think the weight of loss — it can feel that you're losing much more than just the physical actual plant. But I suppose the other thing is: the other memories still remain with you."

— Deborah Crowe

On weeds — the politics of the non-plant

Her public art work Nature Wins! — which covered the Freyberg Steps in central Auckland with enormous images of nasturtiums, clover, and bee-supporting plants during the COVID lockdown — began as an act of what she calls "visual rewilding." But underneath the cheerfulness was a careful political argument.

DC

There was a lot of nasturtiums in that work. I really wanted to emphasize them because I think they're great flowers visually, but also because you can eat every single bit of nasturtium, and also because it's classified as a weed. So it was kind of very subtly looking at: what are these plants that we say are okay, and what are these plants that we say are not? Do you know in German the word for weed is Unkraut — and that means non-plant. It's like you're not even a plant. If you're a plant, that's the worst thing you could ever be.

The taxonomy of plants — what is cultivated, what is wild, what is weed — is not neutral. It reflects what human systems value and what they discard. Crowe's work keeps returning to this: the plants that push through concrete are not just surviving, they are refusing a classification. They are, in her images, colonising what humans have built — reclaiming, rewilding, insisting.

"The weeds growing — it's a reminder that human beings are not the be all and end all. Whatever lessons we can get where we realise, oh actually, there's something else going to happen after me, or humans are not as important as we think we are — there are bigger things at play."

— Deborah Crowe

On mānuka — the quiet plant that shelters others

The Mānuka Dreaming series — large, luminous collages of the scrubby coastal plant — came from a period she spent in the countryside, walking daily among mānuka bushes. She described the plant with a specificity that felt earned rather than aesthetic.

DC

Mānuka is not like hibiscus. It's not a showy bloom. It's a kind of quiet — one of those people who just quietly achieve things. They don't have to go tada. It's very polite, but it's really, really resilient. And it grows up and provides shelter for the more delicate plants underneath. So it's like a cloak — a kind of provision of shelter. It's also often a signal for spring, like a beacon.

The mānuka, she said, is a plant that provides before it is noticed — that makes possible the growth of other, more fragile things beneath its canopy. It struck me that this is also a description of her own practice: the slow accumulation of Outlook images, year after year, building a perceptual archive that makes other people's noticing possible.

On the ideal world — a giant glass house

DC

If I could live in a giant glass house, I'd be very happy. At one end, maybe I'd just be existing in this pure way. And then maybe at the other end of the glass house, it would be scientists growing plants that took away all the fossil fuel emissions. There's something about glass houses and invention — a place where you might concoct something. I quite like that idea. You might concoct this new plant that absorbs so much CO₂ that it's worth its weight in gold or whatever.

She also quoted Alan Weisman's The World Without Us: "In the day after humans disappear, nature takes over and immediately begins cleaning house. Our houses." The world without us, she said, is not gloomy in Weisman's telling — it is a world where ice cracks concrete in New York, weeds push through, forests return to Chernobyl. "Nature probably will always win. Hopefully we hope. We hope. But we're doing quite a lot to try to block that."

* * *

A moment

Object from the conversation

Crowe described an abandoned tennis court at the bottom of a friend's garden in Sandringham — a place she would return to over two or three years to photograph the weeds taking over. A concrete play area, gradually becoming a meadow. Then one neighbour wanted to sell their house, and the neighbourhood gathered to clear the court so it wouldn't look bad from the listing. She went home and made a collage: the house, placed right on top of the tennis court. "For me it didn't seem to be doing any harm," she said. "It had just become a meadow of weeds, which I quite liked." The collage was her answer. The tennis court remains in the image, underneath.

Reading thread

01

The World Without Us — Alan Weisman (2007). On what happens to the built environment when humans are removed from it. Nature's recovery, described without grief and without consolation.

02

Ways of Seeing — John Berger (1972). Crowe invoked this directly: "seeing comes before words." The foundational text on how perception is shaped by knowledge, belief, and social position.

03

Figure and Ground: Making Meaning in the Anthropocene — curated by Angela Rowe (2023). The exhibition catalogue, downloadable from Crowe's website, gathers photo-montage and collage artists responding to the human-environment relationship. Crowe's work appeared in the show.

04

The Unthinkable (formerly Gen Dread) — newsletter by Dr Britt Wray. A resource hub for living with eco-anxiety and finding purpose within the climate crisis. Crowe subscribed for years.